Are there any registered Mac 10 bolts?

[thumpy]

Can you post a link to one of these YouTube videos? I have watched damn near every single YouTube video that so much as even shows a MAC-10 and I’ve never seen anyone demonstrating the drop in full auto bolt conversion. Only time I’ve ever even seen it mentioned in a YouTube video is that video from iraqveteran where that old guy Barry tells his story about working at RPB and briefly explains some of the illegal conversion methods people used to do.

I am well aware that a bolt conversion can be done, it takes 2 minutes with a grinding wheel… but I have never seen a registered machine gun, transferable or post sample, that was built using a bolt conversion vs a properly modified fire control group/receiver. Never seen one of the converted bolts for sale like that either, not even in dozens of 1980s shotgun news issues. I’ve seen them sold unknowingly on gunbroker multiple times in parts kits… the sellers had no idea the bolt had been tampered with I’m sure.

I have seen many post sample MACs for sale, but all have been done properly, either built up from scratch with a folded flat, and drilled for the selector switch… or open bolt semi auto RPB, drilled for the selector switch. I have never seen a registered full auto MAC that didn’t have the holes drilled and selector switch installed. Back in the day when it was legal to convert the gun it was a 150 dollar receiver, people weren’t trying to preserve their shitty dime a dozen MAC frame by doing a full auto only bolt conversion…. They just did it right and drilled the holes and had a select fire gun.

That bolt conversion is just a quick and dirty way to convert the gun to full auto only and be able to restore it back to its factory semi auto configuration like it never happened. It is almost always done illegally as far as I know. If someone was doing the paperwork to convert an RPB, or build a post sample from scratch, they’re just gonna drill the damn hole and do it right, it takes 2 seconds.

Here is one there is more videos on there of post samples haven’t looked for them in a while.

Here is a semi auto open bolt that was converted registered pre 86 that isn’t drilled not sure how they converted it it’s a registered receiver so I’d assume they just cut the trip an that was that. It was sold recently.

WTS, Early Mac 10 Carbine, .45 acp, With Accessories Including Short Upper. $8500.00. Sold

Transferable on a Form 4 : Mac 10 Carbine. .45 acp. RPB mfg. this SMG is a converted semi-auto .45 done by M.D. ordnance of McHenery Illinois. Original Mac carbines are not common kit barrel assembly. Comes with a short MAC 10 upper and accessories as pictured. The Bolt, internals and the bore ar...

www.sturmgewehr.com

 

[MitchWerbellsGhost87]

Here is one there is more videos on there of post samples haven’t looked for them in a while.

Here is a semi auto open bolt that was converted registered pre 86 that isn’t drilled not sure how they converted it it’s a registered receiver so I’d assume they just cut the trip an that was that. It was sold recently.

WTS, Early Mac 10 Carbine, .45 acp, With Accessories Including Short Upper. $8500.00. Sold

Transferable on a Form 4 : Mac 10 Carbine. .45 acp. RPB mfg. this SMG is a converted semi-auto .45 done by M.D. ordnance of McHenery Illinois. Original Mac carbines are not common kit barrel assembly. Comes with a short MAC 10 upper and accessories as pictured. The Bolt, internals and the bore ar...

www.sturmgewehr.com

Ah yes as a matter of fact I have seen that YouTube video now that you shared it. I guess I was expecting to see someone actually showing and describing the bolt. But I think that is the only video on YouTube that shows a drop in post sample bolt. It is not a common way to modify the gun and that is the only example I’ve ever seen of an actual registered M10 bolt conversion. It may become more common among SOTs now that the original RPB open bolts sell for 3k… and a post sample MAC is worth half of that. They don’t wanna destroy the valuable open bolt semi receiver.

The gun on sturm is a receiver conversion, it looks like they must have modified something inside the frame because it’s visible that the sear stud has been replaced. They probably removed the sear carriage, removed the trip, and welded the carriage back in.

That is an early RPB “deluxe” carbine, but it didn’t leave the factory like that. It has an SAP SN, so it left the factory as a pistol. Cool gun, I must have missed that ad on sturm when it ran back in December. It’s rare to even see a full auto only converted MAC that hasn’t been drilled for the selector.

 

[theduke]

more info has been shared in this thread than I've seen since way back in 09 ish. And it was frowned upon then.

Double dum.....let this be over and done.

 

[thumpy]

more info has been shared in this thread than I've seen since way back in 09 ish. And it was frowned upon then.

Double dum.....let this be over and done.

I was trying to keep it from being that but some of these guys didn’t take the hint lol so it is what it is I guess. I wanted it to be a simple yes I’ve seen one or no…

 

[MitchWerbellsGhost87]

“Trying to keep it from being about that”… but started a thread inquiring about converted full autos. That said, there’s nothing illegal about the information itself. I for one think the ease of conversion is part of what makes the gun so interesting as a collectors item, and contributes to its colorful history. There’s entire books published about converting these guns… there is nothing about the info itself that can’t be freely shared, and the process is only illegal if you aren’t supposed to be doing it, even in that case you can still know how..

That guy Barry (RIP) in the video on YouTube put it well. He worked at RPB when they banned the open bolt in 1982 and forced RPB to close their doors. He said that was his first experience with the “thought police”, banning the firearm because of what could potentially be done to it by someone with ill-intent, despite being perfectly legal in its out of box configuration.

I’m honestly not sure why OP would even be interested In this kind of “post sample” conversion being available on the market (other than shear curiosity of course). The only way he could get one would be if he’s an SOT (I doubt he’s looking for a converted bolt M10 pistol for the department) but If he has an SOT then there is no need to purchase someone else’s grinded on bolt when you can do it yourself in less than 5 mins for free… or one of the many other simple means of conversion that is outlined in books or a quick google search.

It’s not like the full auto conversion methods for a MAC haven’t been public knowledge for 50 years or anything. A cursory google search will tell you everything you need to know.

Long story short, No, besides that one YouTube video that was shared, I have never seen anyone advertising or demonstrating a legally registered “post sample” MAC bolt. This particular conversion method is typically done…. Off paper. The only time I have ever seen bolts like this pop up for sale is when it’s done accidentally by an uninformed seller on gunbroker selling demilled “RPB semi auto” pistols, the auctions are usually ended by the seller when knowledgeable bidders tell them what they have and they destroy the bolt (or say they did at least)

Technically the bolt is not a regulated drop in conversion like a slotted Uzi SMG bolt. The grinded M10 bolt could be legally sold as a replacement part for a registered receiver machine gun, albeit full auto only… and it’s not NFA by itself, just like open bolt assemblies for the KG-9 or registered receiver tec-9. They will work as a drop in full auto conversion, but they’re not regulated as such and it’s up to the buyer to abide by the law and only use the bolt in a registered pre-82 open bolt KG9 or a registered receiver Tec-9 SMG.

The same would apply to a full auto only M10 bolt. Just cant install it in a semi auto, or own it alongside one if you aren’t licensed to do so, but I’m fairly certain that if you own a registered M10 SMG, you can purchase yourself a spare bolt and grind it down so that the gun will no longer be selective fire.. wouldn’t it be no different than installing a selector delete pin or removing the trip from your gun for more reliable function?

 

[thumpy]

“Trying to keep it from being about that”… but started a thread inquiring about converted full autos. That said, there’s nothing illegal about the information itself. I for one think the ease of conversion is part of what makes the gun so interesting as a collectors item, and contributes to its colorful history. There’s entire books published about converting these guns… there is nothing about the info itself that can’t be freely shared, and the process is only illegal if you aren’t supposed to be doing it, even in that case you can still know how..

That guy Barry (RIP) in the video on YouTube put it well. He worked at RPB when they banned the open bolt in 1982 and forced RPB to close their doors. He said that was his first experience with the “thought police”, banning the firearm because of what could potentially be done to it by someone with ill-intent, despite being perfectly legal in its out of box configuration.

I’m honestly not sure why OP would even be interested In this kind of “post sample” conversion being available on the market (other than shear curiosity of course). The only way he could get one would be if he’s an SOT (I doubt he’s looking for a converted bolt M10 pistol for the department) but If he has an SOT then there is no need to purchase someone else’s grinded on bolt when you can do it yourself in less than 5 mins for free… or one of the many other simple means of conversion that is outlined in books or a quick google search.

It’s not like the full auto conversion methods for a MAC haven’t been public knowledge for 50 years or anything. A cursory google search will tell you everything you need to know.

Long story short, No, besides that one YouTube video that was shared, I have never seen anyone advertising or demonstrating a legally registered “post sample” MAC bolt. This particular conversion method is typically done…. Off paper. The only time I have ever seen bolts like this pop up for sale is when it’s done accidentally by an uninformed seller on gunbroker selling demilled “RPB semi auto” pistols, the auctions are usually ended by the seller when knowledgeable bidders tell them what they have and they destroy the bolt (or say they did at least)

Technically the bolt is not a regulated drop in conversion like a slotted Uzi SMG bolt. The grinded M10 bolt could be legally sold as a replacement part for a registered receiver machine gun, albeit full auto only… and it’s not NFA by itself, just like open bolt assemblies for the KG-9 or registered receiver tec-9. They will work as a drop in full auto conversion, but they’re not regulated as such and it’s up to the buyer to abide by the law and only use the bolt in a registered pre-82 open bolt KG9 or a registered receiver Tec-9 SMG.

The same would apply to a full auto only M10 bolt. Just cant install it in a semi auto, or own it alongside one if you aren’t licensed to do so, but I’m fairly certain that if you own a registered M10 SMG, you can purchase yourself a spare bolt and grind it down so that the gun will no longer be selective fire.. wouldn’t it be no different than installing a selector delete pin or removing the trip from your gun for more reliable function?

I was inquiring is there any transferable m10 bolts… not on how conversions where done… there are many transferable kg9 bolts , uzi bolts etc floating around. That’s what made me inquire. I’m not interested in a post sample bolt but simply used post samples as examples since more than one guy here was insisting it wouldn’t work.

 

[Homer]

6. “It doesn’t seem fair, does it, Norm? That I should have so much knowledge when there are people in the world that have to go to bed stupid every night?”​

 

[sniperdoc]

While I presume the OP is, as he stated, simply curious,there are so many people who guard the info on conversions like it's their daughter's virginity. As previously stated, the info isn't illegal.

 

[A&S Conversions]

Multiple YouTube videos of people demoing post sample m10 bolts. Seen a few trade hands over the years on sturm an other places no law letter legally registered mg bolts.

You are wrong again no modifications have to be done to the gun. I’m not trying to debate this. Go do your own research or remain wrong. I was asking if any one has seen one that was transferable… that is the question.

Well, I stand corrected. I was wrong. Thank you for educating me.

Scott

 

[theduke]

Stick a fork in this thread.

Many of you I'm sure are on the same page......Not healthy for this site.

This used to be protocal.

I'm done ....do as you wish.

 

[MitchWerbellsGhost87]

Stick a fork in this thread.

Many of you I'm sure are on the same page......Not healthy for this site.

This used to be protocal.

I'm done ....do as you wish.

With all due respect, What if licensed SOTs wanted to discuss their semi auto conversion project here?? So because it can be illegal if done by the wrong people means that we all should not discuss it? What about building a machine gun from scratch? It’s the same damn thing?

The $3500 open bolt Ingram is hardly the first choice for criminals like it was 40 years ago. It may be easy to convert but the majority of the bad guys these days aren’t worried about that because they just buy a full auto Glock switch off Aliexpress for 5 dollars to install in their $500 poly80 Glock… or have one of their tech savvy dope customers 3D print one for them.

The majority of people who are curious about how an Ingram works in 2024 are nerds and collectors. I highly doubt this site is serving as an information hub for street thugs from Detroit or unhinged wackos. That’s who would have been doing this conversion 40 years ago… now this is a rich man’s toy and this information is hardly a threat to anyone’s well being (or the site).

There was also a time when the info wasn’t one click away on a google search. A decade or 2 ago you may have had to go on a board like this and ask around, but now it doesn’t take much more than a quick google search to find all the info you could ever want on this topic. Or just go and buy a copy of “Full Auto Volume II” off Amazon prime and it will show up tomorrow, it has been on the market for decades and is a detailed manual that outlines a half dozen proper conversion methods with photos and instructions.

This info is not restricted. In an earlier post someone said guys on here guard the full auto conversion info like it’s their daughters virginity and I’ve seen that on these gun boards for years and years. No offense but I personally always thought that whole “don’t discuss full auto conversions” was a bit of a “Fudd” mentality towards the subject.

This is a very small community, I’m fairly certain if someone here seemed suspicious or was asking these questions for the wrong reasons, we would be able to sniff that bullshit out pretty quickly. I think everybody involved in this thread is simply talking from a curiosity perspective and having a conversation about it… the info itself at this point might as well be common knowledge in the age of the internet. It’s already out there all over the place, it’s not some big secret that needs to be protected.

 

[thumpy]

With all due respect, What if licensed SOTs wanted to discuss their semi auto conversion project here?? So because it can be illegal if done by the wrong people means that we all should not discuss it? What about building a machine gun from scratch? It’s the same damn thing?

The $3500 open bolt Ingram is hardly the first choice for criminals like it was 40 years ago. It may be easy to convert but the majority of the bad guys these days aren’t worried about that because they just buy a full auto Glock switch off Aliexpress for 5 dollars to install in their $500 poly80 Glock… or have one of their tech savvy dope customers 3D print one for them.

The majority of people who are curious about how an Ingram works in 2024 are nerds and collectors. I highly doubt this site is serving as an information hub for street thugs from Detroit or unhinged wackos. That’s who would have been doing this conversion 40 years ago… now this is a rich man’s toy and this information is hardly a threat to anyone’s well being (or the site).

There was also a time when the info wasn’t one click away on a google search. A decade or 2 ago you may have had to go on a board like this and ask around, but now it doesn’t take much more than a quick google search to find all the info you could ever want on this topic. Or just go and buy a copy of “Full Auto Volume II” off Amazon prime and it will show up tomorrow, it has been on the market for decades and is a detailed manual that outlines a half dozen proper conversion methods with photos and instructions.

This info is not restricted. In an earlier post someone said guys on here guard the full auto conversion info like it’s their daughters virginity and I’ve seen that on these gun boards for years and years. No offense but I personally always thought that whole “don’t discuss full auto conversions” was a bit of a “Fudd” mentality towards the subject.

This is a very small community, I’m fairly certain if someone here seemed suspicious or was asking these questions for the wrong reasons, we would be able to sniff that bullshit out pretty quickly. I think everybody involved in this thread is simply talking from a curiosity perspective and having a conversation about it… the info itself at this point might as well be common knowledge in the age of the internet. It’s already out there all over the place, it’s not some big secret that needs to be protected.

I definitely agree with what you said. I’m not trying to restrict info but the info wasn’t really needed for this thread I again was asking about pre 86 transferagles an over feel like this entire thread was hijacked from the topic I was asking about that is why I personally ways trying to keep it from going down this road. Not that I care about if people know how todo conversions etc. it is free speech/ public knowledge etcetc I just wanted it to stay on the topic I was asking about.

 

[MitchWerbellsGhost87]

I definitely agree with what you said. I’m not trying to restrict info but the info wasn’t really needed for this thread I again was asking about pre 86 transferagles an over feel like this entire thread was hijacked from the topic I was asking about that is why I personally ways trying to keep it from going down this road. Not that I care about if people know how todo conversions etc. it is free speech/ public knowledge etcetc I just wanted it to stay on the topic I was asking about.

Yeah, I hear ya. It definitely got a little derailed when people started doubting that conversion bolt exists. It happens all the time with these threads in these discussion groups, I am guilty of participating in it myself as well, but I tried my best to answer your actual question to the best of my knowledge anyway. I personally have never seen one of those bolts being sold or advertised.

They certainly exist amongst SOTs, but it’s not common and the majority of converted RPB guns you will encounter were done pre-86 and were done right with the hole drilled. There were a few post sample M10s and an M11a1 RPB on GB A few months back, they were sloppily done, but they were fully converted with the holes drilled. One of them was a Texas semi auto closed bolt which actually takes a little ingenuity to convert because the trigger pin hole is not in the standard open bolt location, they had left the hole in its incorrect spot and installed the selector/sear further forward to compensate for it.

Other than that, I rarely see converted post sample MACs for sale, other than cobray M11/9s. The majority of post sample MACs seem to be frame flat builds or weld kit builds done from scratch. There is a seller on gun broker that always has at least one post sample Mac listed, usually frame flat builds from scratch but they do some interesting builds… the one that is currently listed is a semi auto FMJ cobray M12 .380 frame converted into an M11A1 smg, it’s pretty damn cool, they do a nice job whoever they are.