How smooth are the Max-11 and Max-31?

[Slowmo]

For those with experience with the Max-11 and/or Max-31, how do they compare in terms of smoothness/recoil control to popular open bolt guns like Sterlings, Swedish Ks, Uzis, etc? I’m just asking in regards to how they put rounds on target, not their pedigree, combat worthiness, etc.

 

[Jmacken37]

Very smooth. The Max-ll is uzi-like with a slightly higher ROF in my experience. The Max-31 was a game changer in terms of capacity with the drums but even more so with the flatness with how it shoots. You can put rounds in a very small pattern shooting full auto. SMOOTH. I remember Vegas SMG telling me how I needed one and I was late to the game, but became a believer after shooting.
The open bolts you mentioned are great guns and have a cool history. For shooting in a subgun match, I'd grab the Max-31 or Max-11 every time.

 

[stevo]

I have both a Max-31C upper on my M-11 and a pre-May Swedish K. The K is definitely smoother. I have 2 buffers in my Max-31C and when running coffin mags for long bursts, there is an occasional variance in the cyclic rate…..ever so slightly, where the K is constant through an entire mag dump.

 

[Slowmo]

Just out of curiosity, how does it compare without the buffers in the Max-31? Seems like that would be closer in ROF.

 

[stevo]

Still smoother than the Max-31 without additional buffers. Cyclic rate about the same. Swedish K is considered by many to be the best SMG with its balance, weight, and cyclic rate. They’re awesome!

 

[10mmlover]

I don't have a swedish K but as you can see in the video below, even with the higher rate of fire with an added buffer it stays insanely on target. (5:50 timestamp on the video). Even compared to modern SMGs earlier in the video its group is much tighter.

Second video here is mine, where I'm using full power 9mm, and then halfway through it's using my light load 9mm that I'm currently using to go easy on the rear of the receiver. With both of them, things are bouncing around a lot. I'm super happy with it, but it's clearly not as smooth as that Swedish K in the first video. The K literally doesn't move at all in his hands as he does a full mag dump.

 

[stevo]

As far as Uzi’s go, nice cyclic rate, but very “choppy” with that heavy bolt slamming forward…..FWIW.

 

[CKxx]

Swedish K's are very smooth. IMO, even a 76 doesn't compare. It's magical, despite the brick ergos.

I find the max31k "bumpy but controllable."

 

[skiboatsp]

As far as Uzi’s go, nice cyclic rate, but very “choppy” with that heavy bolt slamming forward…..FWIW.

That's debatable.

 

[Jmacken37]

I don't find the Uzi choppy. The Max-31 shoots flatter, in my experience.

 

[stevo]

I’ve owned numerous Uzi’s over the years. To me the standard full size is somewhat choppy…especially if using lethargic ammo. If using full power loads, it’s less noticeable. My mini’s were just too damn fast, but smoot…..fun little buzz guns!

 

[Slowmo]

That's debatable.

The cyclic rate looks faster than stock. Any idea what kind of buffer is being used?

 

[Hey...]

When the 31c first arrived I posted a vid of it shooting as delivered and it was choppy.

Later in the thread I posted other vids where I added some custom spacers giving 850rpm and it got smooth as a sewing machine.

Here’s a guy at the range I let try a drum. Pretty smooth.

 

[brenbuilds]

Smoothness is rather subjective, so opinions could differ wildly. also consider the size and weight of the individual. I find the Sterling L2A3 and the Swedish K to be the "smoothest" submachine guns, but it MP-40's and Stemple takedown guns are also quite tame. If you're shooting very hot ammo like British L7A1 expect some obvious behavioral differences.

 

[Slowmo]

It’s interesting to me that people smooth out the Uzi and Max31 by boosting ROF, but old guns noted for their smoothness like the Sterling, K, and Mp40 are all pretty slow firing.

 

[CKxx]

Those guns have a decent balance and, most importantly, the bolt never touches the rear of the receiver. In an Uzi or Mac I'm pretty sure you're just adjusting the ROF so that the bolt slamming forward is roughly in "tune" with the bolt slamming rearward.

 

[A&S Conversions]

For me, I find that it not just the cyclic rate, but the balance between the mass of the bolt and the mass of the gun. My first experience with open bolt was a full size Uzi. I swore that the gun was doubling because of the lurch from the bolt and then a second lurch from the round going off. I owned a M1A1 Thompson. With the extra mass of the Thompson, the lurch of the bolt was hardly noticeable.

Scott

 

[10mmlover]

Those guns have a decent balance and, most importantly, the bolt never touches the rear of the receiver. In an Uzi or Mac I'm pretty sure you're just adjusting the ROF so that the bolt slamming forward is roughly in "tune" with the bolt slamming rearward.

Having a continuous recoil motion like the Swedish K, AA-12 automatic shotgun, and the Ultimax 100 is something amazing, but in that Garand Thumb video he puts a D cell battery at the rear. That makes the bolt bounce off the rear like our MACs and it's still getting a group that's the size of 2 fingers. There's some additional secret sauce going on there.

 

[sigstroker]

When the 31c first arrived I posted a vid of it shooting as delivered and it was choppy.

Later in the thread I posted other vids where I added some custom spacers giving 850rpm and it got smooth as a sewing machine.

Here’s a guy at the range I let try a drum. Pretty smooth.

In the youtube it's at 850?

 

[Hey...]

Yes 850 and that’s as fast as you can safely make one. Any more buffer stacking and it won’t catch the sear fully.