school me on this DPP gun with a married sear

[secondofangle]

Ruben has this listed for $51,000

https://dealernfa.com/shop/hk-mp5a3...hk-sear-dyer-sef-lower-excellent-h0112-11610/

That's the price that a transferable sear commands, a premium I thought was due to the versatility of a sear being moved between hosts. This sear is married to the double push pin host. So why the premium price?

Either Ruben misunderstands something (doubtful) I misunderstand something (likely) or Ruben hopes we misunderstand something (doubtful).

 

[mattnh]

Agree - that is an oddball/poor conversion.

The receiver is technically a MG (as it has hole drilled for a PP trigger pack) and the registered MG is a sear (the sear is married to to the PP receiver
and it is probably noted as such in box 4h on the F3/F4. I don't think that pack is cut to fit on a semi-auto shelf gun (and it wouldn't be legal to do so even if it were).

Seller is looking for somebody who isn't HK savy and has lots of $$$

-- Matt

 

[A&S Conversions]

Man,I can't say as I have seen such a conversion. First I would want to be sure that the S&H sear was infact registered as a machinegun. Second if the S&H sear is registered, a 94 drilled for the front push pin is the absolute worst host to have the sear installed. Back in the day, the sear was much less expensive than the converted 94. Several smiths at the time would convert the 94 to MP5 configuration, install the sear which would "marry" the sear to the converted 94 host because removing the sear from a firearm that was imported as a rifle with a barrel less than 16" would make the host an unregistered SBR. Why someone would have to receiver drilled for a push pin makes no sense to me. Today you could file a Form 1 and register a converted 94 as a SBR. But having the front push pin hole, the receiver would need to be registered as a machinegun.

Could the front push pin hole be filled in and a full shelf be welded on to the 94 receiver? I don't know. Is that hole mentioned in any of the paperwork that was ever submitted? If so I would not risk the repair. To me, the best case is a registered sear with a parts set. You might be able to sell the host gun to a manufacturer. Once you bought it, you could put the host gun up for sale only to a manufacturer. You have Ruben transfer to package to a manufacturer that wishes to buy the push pin host. Once he receives the host and the sear, he files a Form 2 and registers the host as a post sample, and transfers the sear to your dealer. Of course this is a very limited market. IMHO a MP5 parts set has a market value of $1,500 to $1,800 plus the market value of the sear. How Ruben would think that a converted 94 drilled for a push pin has a market value of $51,000 is beyond me. That is all I have. Maybe someone else might have a different insight. YMMV.

Scott

 

[mattnh]

Personally, I'd steer clear of that clunker...

 

[secondofangle]

Oh, I'll steer clear for sure, I'm just checking my understanding. There is a whole section in that often cited HK article from a while back explaining all this stuff and the history behind it. I read about the "married sears", it's just beyond me why Ruben would try to get "moveable" sear price out of this one.

 

[A&S Conversions]

Have I been under a rock for a few months and missed sear prices increased by 40%? I sold my sear a little over a year ago for $30,000. I was under the impression that market values of HK sears were in the upper $30,000 range. I get that this is Ruben (he tends to be the high water mark of market value) but with the issues of the host receiver how can this be $10,000 above market value? What am I missing?

Scott

 

[secondofangle]

For the past 6-12 months, Ruben has been getting $48-49,000 for registered sear guns with Terry Dyer "once over" All German MP5-marked hosts. This is the first one I've seen break $50,000, and I'm following to track prices (and in the hopes I stumble upon a DLO box.

 

[rentprop1]

For the past 6-12 months, Ruben has been getting $48-49,000 for registered sear guns with Terry Dyer "once over" All German MP5-marked hosts. This is the first one I've seen break $50,000, and I'm following to track prices (and in the hopes I stumble upon a DLO box.

don't know how you can say he's been getting ound unless you know the buyer or have been paying those prices yourself, asking price is one thing, but once you see it disappear from the website you really have no idea what it sold for.....

 

[hkg3k]

Rare Grandfathered Double Push-Pin Sear Gun

This double push-pin Fleming sear gun is legit and would be one of the few registered sear guns converted post May 19th, 1986 which had the receiver drilled for a push pin lower and was later grandfathered to "permanent married" status by ATF.

In the days following the making ban, HK builders (Vollmer in particular) had access to all these conversion sears with which to continue convert guns. I can't recall specifically if Vollmer had approval, or took it upon himself to make sear guns utilizing a swing-down pp lower...I want to say Vollmer had a verbal or letter of approval for this method. Regardless, at some point shortly thereafter...probably after examination of one of these conversions in the field...ATF ruled this method of conversion actually created another unregistered machine gun; put a halt to this method and made the (in)famous "drilling a hole creates a machine gun" ruling.

IIRC, it was at this time ATF also ruled AK47s could not be converted via registered AK47 full auto sears (registered prior to the ban) due to the requirement to drill the additional hole in the AK47's receiver. At that point there were already registered sear swing-down pp HKs and "registered sear" AK47s in civilian hands, so ATF decided to "grandfather" and allow those already made/registered, but allow no more conversions of this type. Further, HK registered sear gun conversions became exclusively clip-on and the remainder of those transferable AK47 sears registered prior to May 19th were disallowed...

It is also interesting that at the time of this ruling Vollmer had a quantity of receivers his shop which had been modified (shelf removed and hole drilled) to accept a swing-down lower with registered sear. ATF ruled these modified receivers were now post sample machine guns. Vollmer asked permission to return these receivers to semi-auto configuration. ATF refused...once a machine gun always a machine gun. Right? Wrong. Vollmer sued ATF and won the right to return these receivers to their original semi-auto configuration...and probably converted every single one to a clip-on sear gun configuration. The fact Vollmer won this law suit is probably evidence ATF initially gave permission for the swing-down pp registered sear configuration.

That's my recollection of those events...

 

[secondofangle]

My understanding is that there is no haggling with Ruben

 

[Renegade]

Most I have gotten off Rub is $3000 on 3 gun purchase, with 5-6 priors, so I was a good customer (technically proxy buyer).

I would love to see the F2/F3/F4 on one of these to be sure what is the registered part.