How to sell class 3?

[dchi]

I was wondering how do you sell a transferable class 3 firearm on a form 4? I know I can find buyers really quick but what are the steps to take? Collect funds 1st, then what? I don't want to use a broker if possible.

 

[Quarterbore]

It requires a level of trust by either you or the buyer. The process normally involves you listing the item for sale and a buyer committing to buy. Smart buyers will aks for detailed photos and contact information and then I would expect them to "look you up" and call you at home and work, etc. I also ask for references if I am buying an expensive item over the web.

Once the buyer and seller agree on a price, if the buyer is comfortable sending money they can pay you up front and the paperwork would start. If I didn't trust you, I would likely just walk away as these purchase are big $$$ and it is too hard to figure out if you are dealing with a thief in time to prevent getting burnt. I am sure I am not the only one that has passed on deals that just seem too good because something just didn't seem right.

Now, some people will only pay 50% up front and then the second 50% once the approved paperwork comes back. This is safer as you only lay out half the money but few sellers want to work that way.

A face to face sale is best as then the buyer and seller can meet face to face, the buyer can see and hopefully shoot the weapon, they can inspect the seller's form 4s, and you can do the paperwork together and when it comes back just meet and hand over the machinegun and APPROVED Form 4. I know that is my preference if possible and I pay more locally then I would for some out of state sale by anyone other then a dealer.

Good Luck!

 

[nationwide]

Another thing you can do is find a reputable dealer in your state, and transfer it to him on a form 3...

You get the benefit of his reputation, and also tax free out of state transfers (since you already took the $200 hit to transfer to form 3)

 

[MuzzleFlash]

Another thing you can do is find a reputable dealer in your state, and transfer it to him on a form 3...

You get the benefit of his reputation, and also tax free out of state transfers (since you already took the $200 hit to transfer to form 3)

That would be a Form 4, not Form 3. F3 is for dealer to dealer tax exempt only.

Also, this would take a bite out of your proceeds. Finally, if you changed your mind, you're out $400 for the round trip plus what the dealer charged for the consignment.

Just post an ad on Sturm. Offer pictures, answer questrions, offer to provide character references if he appears nervous, etc. Only if the buyer is a total insecure boob, offer to have a mutually agreeable party hold the cash. Make the buyer pay the fee to the third party since it's for his peace of mind.

 

[tony k]

I've never needed to post an ad -- every time I have wanted/needed to sell an MG, I just passed the word among my shooting/internet friends, and immediately the cash appeared in my hands. I just set a realistic price, and buyers liked the idea that (a) they could test-shoot the gun as much as they wanted, and (b) they knew where I lived, so I wasn't gonna vanish with the bucks.

I did have to download all the Form 4s from titleii.com and fill them out. No biggie.

That said, I am now down to my minimum MG collection, so I don't expect to ever be a seller again. That's my heirs' problem now.

 

[dchi]

Ok, so I get a copy of a form 4. Do i and the intended buyer fill them out? He sends his off to the BATF and pays the tax, does his back ground check, and waits for approval. He waits to gets it back signed and shows me. Then I hand over the weapon. Is that correct? Do I need a copy of his appoved form 4? How can I be sure its real? Last thing what do I do with my original copy with stamp?

Oh what if the buyer is from another state? Is these easy to do this by myself? I don't mind waiting but if its a hassle I might let a class 3 dealer handle it. But I was a little ticked by how little my dealer did to transfer it to me and he charged me a $100. Seems like I did everything myself. He says he charges 10 % for selling items.

 

[infoseeker456]

You would typically fill out the form 4 for in state transfers. If it is out of state you have to use a dealer. Form 4 to dealer and another form 4 from dealer to buyer. Takes a bit of time.

 

[MuzzleFlash]

You would typically fill out the form 4 for in state transfers. If it is out of state you have to use a dealer. Form 4 to dealer and another form 4 from dealer to buyer. Takes a bit of time.

The dealer referred to here is the buyer's state dealer. The law considers the initial transfer (whether in-state or to a SOT dealer out-of-state) to be your excise tax return. So the F4, after it is approved, will be mailed to you. You make a copy for your records and include the original with the gun when you send it to the transferee. Remember, if you're transferring to an out-of-state SOT dealer, only the front side of the F4 has to be filled out. Also, just about all ATF forms are filled out in duplicate. That should go without saying.

You should contact the ATF in your area and ask them to send you the Form 4s and fingerprint cards (the cards are for the buyer if s/he is in-state and purchasing as an individual). Maybe get extra copies in case you make a mistake. You can also download and print the forms from titleii.com, but they MUST be double-sided. And you'd still need FP cards if the buyer is in-state. All signatures must be in original ink so photocopying the forms is out. Be sure and circle the statement that allows the transferee to call and get status.

When selling a gun, you need to make it clear who pays the transfer(s) and the overnight insured shipping.

 

[muta4warrior]

Ok, so I get a copy of a form 4. Do i and the intended buyer fill them out?
Yes, you and the buyer would both fill the forms out.

He sends his off to the BATF and pays the tax, does his back ground check, and waits for approval. He waits to gets it back signed and shows me. Then I hand over the weapon. Is that correct? Do I need a copy of his appoved form 4? How can I be sure its real?

The approved forms will come back to you then you contact the buyer and have them come pick everything up.

Last thing what do I do with my original copy with stamp?

Keep it and frame it, sell it on Ebay, shread it.

Oh what if the buyer is from another state?

You will treat it just like a Title 1 transfer (for the most part), you will fill out a Form 4 with his dealers info, pay the $200 tax, forms will come back to you, ship to said dealer.

Is these easy to do this by myself?

It is no harder then doing the transfer to the instate buyer.

I don't mind waiting but if its a hassle I might let a class 3 dealer handle it. But I was a little ticked by how little my dealer did to transfer it to me and he charged me a $100. Seems like I did everything myself. He says he charges 10 % for selling items.

Sounds like you need to find another dealer.

.

 

[deus vult]

Sorry to bump such an old thread but I just sold my mini uzi and a couple of SBR's to out of state buyers and I'm getting conflicting information on how to proceed with the transfers.

Can I legally: Transfer an NFA item to an out of state dealer on a Form 4 from me (a non licensed individual) to the out of state dealer?

I know I can use an in state dealer and transfer to him on a Form 4 and he would Form 3 the item to the out of state dealer who would then Form 4 to the buyer... but I would really like to avoid the in state dealer transfer fees on my end if I can.

I called the BATFE here in Austin who referred me to the San Antonio office who gave me this number: 304-616-4500 who listened to my question then told me they would have to call me back.

Has anyone here done this? Transfer an NFA item directly to an out of state C3 dealer on an approved Form 4 without using a C3 dealer in their state?

 

[captbill]

form 4 transfer

You can transfer on a form 4 across stateline if the gun is a "C&R" and the recipiant has a "C&R" license. Don't forget the finger print card in any case. Form 4's are usually done as an online document and printed out to be signed now. You can get fingerprint cards from ATF- be sure to use ATF fingerprint cards there are differances.

 

[deus vult]

You can transfer on a form 4 across stateline if the gun is a "C&R" and the recipiant has a "C&R" license. Don't forget the finger print card in any case. Form 4's are usually done as an online document and printed out to be signed now. You can get fingerprint cards from ATF- be sure to use ATF fingerprint cards there are differances.

Ok I got a call back from a lady at NFA Branch and she said I can ship across state lines to an SOT with an approved Form 4 without using a local SOT.

Shortly after that I got a call from a BATFE agent here locally that I had called and he said I needed to use a local SOT, do a Form 4 to the local SOT, then local SOT would transfer to out of state SOT. I informed him of my conversation with the lady from the NFA Branch and he said he would double check and call me back.

He called me back a short while later and said that yes I could ship out of state as an individual (non licensee) to a SOT in another state.

I am now still thoroughly unsure of what the correct answer is... has anyone here personally shipped an NFA item to an out of state SOT on an approved Form 4 without using a local SOT?

 

[SecondAmend]

I (an individual) have personally shipped a machine gun that was transferred via a BATFE Form 4 to a Class 3 FFL Dealer in another state this year. The NFA Branch and the ATF angent's call back that you got are correct. For shipping, I used FedEx ground, insured, and had no problems in any regard.

Best of luck with your process.

Not legal advice, MHO, YMMV, I am not affiliated with FedEx or the BATFE nor do I endorse either entity, etc.

 

[deus vult]

I (an individual) have personally shipped a machine gun that was transferred via a BATFE Form 4 to a Class 3 FFL Dealer in another state this year. The NFA Branch and the ATF angent's call back that you got are correct. For shipping, I used FedEx ground, insured, and had no problems in any regard.

Best of luck with your process.

Not legal advice, MHO, YMMV, I am not affiliated with FedEx or the BATFE nor do I endorse either entity, etc.

Thank you that's what I was looking for, actual first hand experience from someone that had done that before. Even if it had been tried but disapproved I just needed to know one way or the other. But it sounds like I should be gtg using this method. Just in case I better hide the dog. I kid I kid... I don't have a dog just a flying squirrel named Bullet and she's too fast it would be impossible for anyone to stomp on her!!

 

[deus vult]

Buyers SOT dealer contacted the same NFA Branch lady I spoke to earlier and she told him the same thing... private party transfer to out of state SOT dealer on an approved Form 4 does not need to go through a local SOT to be sent across state lines (to the SOT dealer on the approved Form 4) Whew... glad we got that straightened out!!

 

[blick]

The US Marshalls shot the Weaver's dog. That's what started the whole mess at Ruby Ridge. It wasn't ATF, as much as the batfags deserver opprobriation. They also are not the ones who burned the kids at Waco. That was the FBI.

 

[GoingQuiet]

The US Marshalls shot the Weaver's dog. That's what started the whole mess at Ruby Ridge. It wasn't ATF, as much as the batfags deserver opprobriation. They also are not the ones who burned the kids at Waco. That was the FBI.

Did someone go off meds?